hacking the ECU - SV1000 Portal
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post #1 of 81 (permalink) Old 18th December 2007, 08:04 PM Thread Starter
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hacking the ECU

Hi all, for the last month or so I've been pulling the ECU to pieces for a k7 thou, working on a way to alter the fuel and ignition maps in there. So far I've been able to download all the code and maps out of the ECU,... here's a thread I started in the SVDownUnder site ...

http://www.svdownunder.com/index.php?topic=14682.0

In here I've also posted instructions on how/where to download a copy of the binary I pulled out of the ECU, and examine the maps yourself using some freeware (Enginuity) ...

What I am looking for, and perhaps someone here may be able to help, are more ECUs to hack, ... they don't need to be working ECUs - even if they've got burned out injector or ignition lines the internal central processor is still likely to be OK enough for me to extract the code and maps.

I'm interested to see what the variations are between model years.

Unfortunately it is damn near impossible to find ECUs for the thous. So, if you have an old one kicking around, and wanna dispose of it for a reasonable price, or even donate it to science, lemme know.

Cheers,
Mark.
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post #2 of 81 (permalink) Old 18th December 2007, 08:21 PM
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Hi all, for the last month or so I've been pulling the ECU to pieces for a k7 thou, working on a way to alter the fuel and ignition maps in there. So far I've been able to download all the code and maps out of the ECU,... here's a thread I started in the SVDownUnder site ...

http://www.svdownunder.com/index.php?topic=14682.0

In here I've also posted instructions on how/where to download a copy of the binary I pulled out of the ECU, and examine the maps yourself using some freeware (Enginuity) ...

What I am looking for, and perhaps someone here may be able to help, are more ECUs to hack, ... they don't need to be working ECUs - even if they've got burned out injector or ignition lines the internal central processor is still likely to be OK enough for me to extract the code and maps.

I'm interested to see what the variations are between model years.

Unfortunately it is damn near impossible to find ECUs for the thous. So, if you have an old one kicking around, and wanna dispose of it for a reasonable price, or even donate it to science, lemme know.

Cheers,
Mark.
Been here nearly 4 years and never heard of one needing to replace one... Seems like a lot of work to get around buying the PCIIIusb...


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post #3 of 81 (permalink) Old 18th December 2007, 08:26 PM
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u beat me to it....pc111...make life easy....er
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post #4 of 81 (permalink) Old 18th December 2007, 09:57 PM
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come on guys. this is some cool stuff!!! If he can get the stock maps for each of the different years we could see what the differences are between ignition and fuel maps and how the power commanders actually work.


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post #5 of 81 (permalink) Old 18th December 2007, 10:02 PM
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come on guys. this is some cool stuff!!! If he can get the stock maps for each of the different years we could see what the differences are between ignition and fuel maps and how the power commanders actually work.
Agreed, it's not about the end result, it's about what you COULD do.

Anyways though, I'm in agreement these ECUs are pretty rock solid.

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post #6 of 81 (permalink) Old 18th December 2007, 10:12 PM
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boy what a thread that was.....hats up for those guys!!!!bigclap:

and it's not about the potential use of their findings but for their balls to try and see that trough...

ps: i didn't understand half of it......
i can do nut's n bolts but errr bits n bytes are just greek to me......
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post #7 of 81 (permalink) Old 18th December 2007, 10:46 PM
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Yes Bozo, there are many of us who aren't posting, but are watching intently. I've been looking for you, but I've yet to come across any ECUs... I do however have the word out, but it's not looking real hopeful.

Anyone that thinks the point is to make a PCIII replacement, needs their head read.
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post #8 of 81 (permalink) Old 18th December 2007, 11:13 PM
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Wow, nice job Bozo! This is the thread I'd be interested in. Acetone took off the potting compound without smearing all the white letter screen on the circuit board?

Hard part is all the Flash EEPROM code stuff. Boggles my mind. Gotta know how to speak binary to understand that stuff. Nice to see you found a Hitachi processor. 916 pages in the manual? The service manual says there are 8 different fuel maps.

Local Suzuki dealer said there is a OEM Suzuki FI controller or software for $500.00+ to "look into" the ECU, kinda like a code reader/scanner for an automobile. Didn't ask how to get one, probably from Japan. www.suzukipitstop.com

I'd like to see the ignition mapping and how it changes due to all the FI variables. Maybe it's just a simple curve?
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post #9 of 81 (permalink) Old 18th December 2007, 11:29 PM
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This is quite cool.

The benifits of hacking the ECU over just putting on a PCIII is that with the correct software you can adjust everything the ECU controlls, not just adding some fuel as needed like the PCIII does. You could adjust the spark advance, add (or remove) fuel as needed, and I imagine adjust the idle and the opening of the secondary butterflys.

Of course, in addition to hacking the computers you would need to add, or adapt, software to modify the programming.

This is what the Buell guys do to their bikes since a PCIII will not work, but they get to adjust the spark map, the fueling, cold start enrichment, etc.

Of course this is a big undertaking, and since there has been little work done on it to date (at least it sounds like it) a better step might be to switch to MegaSquirt ( www.msefi.com ). MS basically allows you to control the fuel and spark for dang near any engine, heck you can build the fuel and spark systems from scratch and control it. Plus, it's fairly cheap (~$500).
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post #10 of 81 (permalink) Old 21st December 2007, 09:48 PM
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Great project! Hopefully with some good and usefull results...

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post #11 of 81 (permalink) Old 25th December 2007, 06:01 PM
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Thats a lot of great work bozo. I wish I could be arsed to learn such a skill but I am to damn lazy and retarded for stuff that advanced. Let us know when you devise the way of altering ALL the mapping without paying all that $$$$ for various power commander components. Widen your skill to most popular ECU's and my man, you could be a millionaire.

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post #12 of 81 (permalink) Old 25th December 2007, 11:24 PM
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Wow this is great stuff, nice work. If you need another ECU look at metallic5spd post http://www.sv-portal.com/forums/showthread.php?t=28393

I have a TEKA box and had thought about tearing into that just for fun to look at the access protocol used to program the stock ECUs.

If you do get to the maps they might be really hard to decode. If you clock out the data it might not mean much unless you run an experiment where you change 1 parameter and look at the change in the string being read out. I am looking into a few things also along with a friend of mine. I gave him the link you sent and he is hashing it over to see if he can come up with anything.

The problem with TEKA boxes is that you can only push data so trying to get the sequence to read out data may be much more difficult.

Do you know anybody with the SDS hook up? This is the Suzuki Diagnostics Sytems that USBs into a PC. THen you need the correct software. This might also allow some insight. I know you get active info from most all the sensors and such, but not sure about FI and Ign maps.

SDS 09904-41010 about $650
CD ROM 99565-01010-012 about $140

Ouch!

Cheers
-MS


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post #13 of 81 (permalink) Old 26th December 2007, 08:51 AM
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What I am saying that implications are vast. You could tweek out stock mapping of fuel and ignition for various configurations and that would be adjustible by ecu for altitude and temperature and would use various sensors feedback as opposing to 'dumb' PC that only remaps for given run conditions. you would still need a dyno and exhaust analyser. The only issue might be the amount of read/writes you can safely perform with the ecu before bricking it. Great stuff!

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post #14 of 81 (permalink) Old 26th December 2007, 08:57 AM
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Blimey ... you chaps are so.... so... er.. techie.. but keep up the good work...
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post #15 of 81 (permalink) Old 26th December 2007, 11:55 AM Thread Starter
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If you do get to the maps they might be really hard to decode.
Yes, I found 170+ maps in there ... have no idea what most of them are, but have a fair idea about which ones might be fuel maps ... currently I'm in the process of disassembling the code to determine what the maps really are, and the values on the X- and Y- axes of each map

Denso have done a fine job of making the code as difficult to interpret as possible, so that's slowing me up a bit.

The tech specs for the 7052 in the guts of it all say that it's good for about 100 reflashes ... I hope they're being pessimistic ...
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